{"id":145,"date":"2009-02-15T07:24:46","date_gmt":"2009-02-15T14:24:46","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/?p=145"},"modified":"2009-02-15T07:24:46","modified_gmt":"2009-02-15T14:24:46","slug":"entrevista-a-ivan-gordillo-el-capitalisme-no-pot-deixar-de-creixer-cal-canviar-de-sistema","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/2009\/02\/15\/entrevista-a-ivan-gordillo-el-capitalisme-no-pot-deixar-de-creixer-cal-canviar-de-sistema\/","title":{"rendered":"Entrevista a Ivan Gordillo: \u00abEl capitalisme no pot deixar de cr\u00e9ixer. Cal canviar de sistema\u00bb"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Dissabte passat (14.02.2009) <em>El Periodico de Catalunya<\/em> entrevista Ivan Gordillo, membre del Seminari Taifa arran del col.loqui \u00abcapitalisme vs. ecologia\u00bb organitzat per la Fundaci\u00f3 Pere Ardiaca.<\/p>\n<div id=\"attachment_247\" style=\"width: 260px\" class=\"wp-caption alignleft\"><a href=\"http:\/\/proves.seminaritaifa.org\/files\/2009\/02\/f039bh12.jpg\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" aria-describedby=\"caption-attachment-247\" src=\"http:\/\/proves.seminaritaifa.org\/files\/2009\/02\/f039bh12.jpg\" alt='Ivan Gordillo' title=\"Ivan Gordillo\" width=\"250\" height=\"124\" class=\"size-full wp-image-247\" \/><\/a><p id=\"caption-attachment-247\" class=\"wp-caption-text\">Ivan Gordillo<\/p><\/div>\n<p><strong>Entrevista original:<\/strong> I<a href=\"http:\/\/www.elperiodico.cat\/default.asp?idpublicacio_PK=46&amp;idioma=CAT&amp;idnoticia_PK=586969&amp;idseccio_PK=1026\">v\u00e1n Gordillo: \u00abEl capitalisme no pot deixar de cr\u00e9ixer. Cal canviar de sistema\u00bb<\/a><br \/>\n<strong>C\u00f2pia local (a continuaci\u00f3):<\/strong><br \/>\n<!--more--><\/p>\n<p><strong>Iv\u00e1n Gordillo: \u00abEl capitalisme no pot deixar de cr\u00e9ixer. Cal canviar de sistema\u00bb<\/strong><\/p>\n<p>Foto: FRANCESC CASALS<br \/>\nEntrevista: SONIA GARC\u00cdA GARC\u00cdA<\/p>\n<p>COL.LOQUI &#8216;CAPITALISME VS ECOLOGIA&#8217;.<br \/>\nFundaci\u00f3 Pere Ardiaca.<br \/>\nA les 11.00 hores.<br \/>\nPortal de l&#8217;\u00c0ngel, 42.<br \/>\nEntrada lliure.<\/p>\n<p>Iv\u00e1n Gordillo \u00e9s membre del Seminari d&#8217;Economia Cr\u00edtica Taifa, on, juntament amb catedr\u00e0tics, estudiants i l\u00edders de moviments socials, mant\u00e9 una visi\u00f3 cr\u00edtica de l&#8217;economia. Avui participa en el col.loqui Capitalisme vs Ecologia, que organitza la Fundaci\u00f3 Pere Ardiaca i moderar\u00e0 Sandro Maccarrone.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bf\u00c9s pura coincid\u00e8ncia la crisi econ\u00f2mica mundial i la crisi mediambiental?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;S\u00f3n q\u00fcestions molt \u00e0mplies. El cert \u00e9s que hi ha d&#8217;haver uns l\u00edmits ecol\u00f2gics al desenvolupament capitalista. No \u00e9s possible extreure recursos naturals de forma infinita.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bfQu\u00e8 explicar\u00e0 del capitalisme?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;El capitalisme est\u00e0 altament concentrat i jerarquitzat. T\u00e9 un centre dominant i depredador i una perif\u00e8ria espoliada.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bfI de l&#8217;ecologia?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;L&#8217;economia ortodoxa capitalista no ha tingut en compte els l\u00edmits eco- l\u00f2gics. I per poder mantenir els seus \u00edndexs de desenvolupament, pa\u00efsos com els EUA necessitarien explotar unes cinc vegades m\u00e9s del seu territori. \u00c9s a dir, d&#8217;acord amb aquest creixement, el m\u00f3n necessitaria cinc planetes m\u00e9s per poder sobreviure.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>Un sistema depredador, \u00e9s clar.<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;\u00c9s una espiral: l&#8217;acumulaci\u00f3 del capital obliga a invertir i guanyar, i aquests guanys invertir-los i guanyar encara m\u00e9s. El capitalisme ha superat les fronteres: inverteix en qualsevol part del m\u00f3n, \u00e9s el predomini de les empreses multinacionals i de la compet\u00e8ncia.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bfI l&#8217;energia s&#8217;acaba?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;Una de les caracter\u00edstiques del sistema capitalista \u00e9s que l&#8217;acumulaci\u00f3 est\u00e0 basada en el creixement, i aquest, en l&#8217;energia f\u00f2ssil barata: el petroli. I com a recurs renovable arribar\u00e0 al seu l\u00edmit d&#8217;extracci\u00f3.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>Per\u00f2 els grans danys ambientals s\u00f3n irreversibles.<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;S&#8217;han proposat indicadors per intentar integrar els danys ecol\u00f2gics a l&#8217;evoluci\u00f3 de l&#8217;economia i s&#8217;ha observat que estem consumint combustibles f\u00f2ssils a un ritme 100.000 vegades superior al ritme de formaci\u00f3.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bfS&#8217;ha de frenar el creixement?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;El capitalisme no pot deixar de cr\u00e9ixer, \u00e9s una fal.l\u00e0cia. Cal canviar de sistema.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>\u00bfQuin sistema proposa?<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;Un sistema socioecon\u00f2mic en qu\u00e8 la propietat col.lectiva dels mitjans de producci\u00f3 permeti un acc\u00e9s democr\u00e0tic tant a la satisfacci\u00f3 de necessitats com a la decisi\u00f3 sobre qu\u00e8 produir, segons les limitacions ecol\u00f2giques.<\/p>\n<p>&#8212;<strong>Aix\u00f2 seria un retroc\u00e9s.<\/strong><br \/>\n&#8211;Ens fan por les paraules, per\u00f2 el socialisme \u00e9s un sistema del qual ja se&#8217;n parlava fa m\u00e9s de 200 anys i els fets li donen la ra\u00f3 i ho hem de dir.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>El Periodico de Catalunya entrevista Ivan Gordillo, membre del Seminari Taifa arran del col.loqui \u00abcapitalisme vs. ecologia\u00bb organitzat per la Fundaci\u00f3 Pere Ardiaca.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":4,"featured_media":247,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_hide_featured_image":false,"_jetpack_featured_image_duplicate_dismissed":0,"_jetpack_feature_clip_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false},"categories":[6],"tags":[68,112],"class_list":["post-145","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-membres-taifa","tag-crisi","tag-entrevistes"],"jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-content\/uploads\/2009\/02\/f039bh12-1.jpg","_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/145","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/4"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=145"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/145\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/247"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=145"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=145"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/seminaritaifa.org\/taifa\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=145"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}